We have been approached by ICASA regarding a CTWUG member possibly selling internet for profit using the CTWUG infrastructure. This is obviously a serious allegation and not one that can be taken lightly. This could have serious consequences for the wugger running this kind of operation as well as CTWUG.
This could results in:
CTWUG could have its license revoked and would mean a shutdown of the complete network.
There is also a possible R30 000 penalty . We could face such a penalty as CTWUG.
We’d prefer if the wugger(s) involved face the penalties and fines.
2.6.7. Operation of commercial, paid-for network services on the WUG is forbidden. This includes commercial Internet access.
The committee is currently investigating.
We also find it quite concerning that CTWUG is now becoming at risk due to a minority trying to use the WUG for their own profits. If you are currently engaged in such activity we warn you to stop immediately. Wuggers found to be active with such activity will be treated in the harshest manner possible.
We will also fully co-operate with ICASA on their investigations. To report any allegations of such activities, please email committee@ctwug.za.net
Firstly , Something ive noticed from helping wuggers that have inet&wug, techies who have assisted them before dont firewall their internet and wug correctly, this results in their routers being “open” to anyone routing via their routers.
Lastly, you are skum if you profiting like this from the wug! sharing is caring and profiting is profiting.
We all knew this was bound to happen sooner or later. I hope this does not lead to people having to choose between being part of CTWUG and breaking off areas for internet services. It took along time to grow the network and it wouldn’t be nice to loose a lot of people if didn’t have to.
I hope that CTWUG can acquire answers for the following questions from ICASA as I trust that we all want to be complaint to CTWUG’s and ICASA’s rules and regulations.
I feel that the answers to the following questions will be beneficial and post clarity to all wuggers:
Is a problem with crossing municipal property when internet is being shared and does this require a licence?
Is Internet cost sharing for non-profiting (Income-Expenses =0), fine?
If it is not fine, is there a licence we can buy for internet sharing and non-profiting?
Is internet sharing for free, acceptable and is a licence required?
Is it acceptable for a surplus is made from internet cost sharing for maintenance/upgrade purposes and not for personal gain?
If a person wants to make a profit and be part of CTWUG, can he/she acquire a licence and still be part of CTWUG? Can limitations be set eg. not going into other areas. ie. Internet only sold from the nodes own sites.
In terms of profiting, what is a profit? Can a person be paid for his/her time for performing checks and repairs as all NGO’s have people working for them? A profit should be income less all operating expenses.
Easy, your answer to all six questions , its Illegal and has been from day one we are not a WISP <---- this requires a license.
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.Remove the people and their links , these are non-negotiables not sure why committee should faf around with those implicated.
Do you speak on behalf of CTWUG administration?
Yes, SLA;s and OLA’s maybe required but this has not yet been determined. Can someone from CTWUG administration find out for sure from ICASA so that we all are informed on what can be done, accepted and what won’t be accepted?
Being an NGO/NP does not necessary mean that there is no income. It means that there is no profiting. There are operating costs in almost all NGOs.
This is shocking regarding the poor answers to valid questions
CTWUG =NPO (Non profitable Organisation)
What is NPO organisation?
What is Icasa rules regarding selling a service under NPO?
What makes selling internet illegal?
CTWUG works on donations basis due to NPO status what how much cash does CTWUG have 100k or less?
Its donation based, based on a network stating its for educational purposes yet people does not join for educational purpuses they join for other reasons. The reason i say this is for following:
People providing internet can they then also not claim people are giving them a donation for it and let the money just lay in thr bank account and claim its for network projects then that would mean its not for personal gain but for the greater good and let 100k lay in a bank account
why not go and engage with ICASA or WAPA or simply do the reading and research for these answers?! You can jump on ur head as much as you want it wont change anything!!! These are not CTWUG Laws, CTWUG is merely following it. Full Stop. Its illegal. Full Stop.
In all honesty I think this is long overdue, I am sure that most Wugger know or know of someone who is sharing internet and I am not saying that everyone is making a profit but to put it into perspective without internet being shared over the Wug it will improve the network and motivate those who prefer having Wug over Internet improve the network and get more involved. The main fact is “Rules are Rules” and it is there to protect Wuggers and the CTWUG network so at the end of the day it would be best for those sharing or just profiting on internet over the Wug to stop what they are doing and just go the legal route, apply for licence then they will be free to do as they please. The sad thing is that I am sure there are people who are not making profit and just providing those who does not have either cash for internet or do not have proper internet service providers in their areas but I guess the rules apply to all regardless of situation.
May I ask why we are having so many versions of Anonymous in this post? We are all grown-ups, and should thus not be scared to voice an opinion?
To answer a few:
Icasa rules related to selling anything is not related to the type of organisation, thus you are breaking the law in selling anything unless you are licensed.
The simple definition for “commercial” is when you receive some sort of remuneration for a service or product. Bluntly put: Lock 'em up!!! Equipment that cost a lot of money from people that gain absolutely nothing from this is being used to facilitate that person’s income.
Just a simple closing statement: You do realise that all of these would be trackable (or worst case rebuildable) anyways? Hell even Google & Apple track your locations…
Thanks Stiaanm for providing sort of a answer although it does not fully answer all questions. Unfortunately, people are not mature enough to be able to manage identities as they attack the person and draw conclusions.
Yes, we all want to be compliant and therefore we want guidance on how to get there and what is/can be acceptable by both CTWUG and ICASA. The world is evolving, maybe rules needs to be changed.
It would actually be great if ICASA could share information as answers received here, all mention its illegal but nothing is being said of how to make this legal.
Wrt closing statement, nothing illegal has been said unless questions said to become compliant and legal, are “illegal”?
Can somebody please provide an answer for each question or is it too much to ask?
Spin please remove my item if you going to edit my main part out of the post on why i came to that conclusion once again ctwug bending rules to suit them and hide the truth
What goes for 1 should go for all the rest.this is what happens when u buddy buddy is involved and turning a blind eye now you ppl responsible for this must stand for it! like Stiaan said we’re all men here act like it and take it like a man. Lol funny how the wheel turns
KGB - Not sure what you mean. Do you mean getting answers for questions not asked or for making everything illegal and not trying to assist people to become compliant or for the editing of posts to suite your needs?
I trust that no one will be sharing internet over a wireless link, whether for free or for any reason.
I guess ICASA might be the only organisation that might answer questions asked. Will have to get their input on the matter.